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Its going to be a lot of Gibby and a lot of Bloodhound
ID: gq5y5adID: gq545yyGibby gonna be close to 100% with Caustic getting hard nerfed. Gonna be a few Caustic teams and they're gonna be fine since Caustic only gets stronger with less Caustics in the lobby, but Gibby Wraith BH/Crypto is just gonna be standard now.
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These are my thoughts regarding legends meta purely as a spectator. I'm not gonna touch on other changes like Mastiff nerf or survival slots. I'd love to hear peoples opinions on why i might be wrong or overlooking something.
The Caustic nerf will probably shift the meta away from him ( thank fucking god). Gas is currently by far the best area of denial ability but after the patch you can spend over 20 seconds in there. If you get ult'ed, you can avoid gas for like 1-2 ticks and then walk right back in and know you wont get killed solely by gas because ult only lasts 20 seconds. Additionally, Ult cooldown increased so he wont have it for every fight. So this makes rushing Caustics teams much more viable. Before, you can down a guy but if hes safe within gas, you cant even risk going for the finish. Now we might see more teams take advantage of their down to finish off a team, gas be damned. So based on all this i think his pickrate will plummet.
Will Wattson take Caustics place? eh, not too sure. Her new shield regen passive is nice but I kinda feel like people might be overrating it a bit with the "shield swap to build easy red evos without wasting meds" idea. Yea obviously it will help but I mean she already kinda did that with her ult anyway. This new passive gives her .5 shield/second charge rate so it would take 200 seconds or about 3.5 minutes to fully recharge purple armor so on its own its not really that viable for free heals. It apparently stacks with her ult though which already gave 2 shield/second, so wattson can get 2.5 shield/second next to her ult. So if she wants to recharge broken purple armor with her ult, it will take 40 seconds now instead of 50. Doesn't seem like a huge buff in comp context imo, at least not enough to automatically make her meta. Realistically Wattson only comes back into the meta if Caustics nerf really leaves a defensive legend void for her to fill. And I just don't know if her kit can really compare to caustics for area of denial. Casutics gas was better than fences by a mile and his ult makes him potent offensively which wattson can never recreate. I feel like teams would still much rather have other legends unless they're really confident in their zone play and want to camp buildings.
I don't think the Gibby nerf will really affect his pick rate. It will definitely have an impact on how good he is but I feel like the bubble on its own is still so valuable that it didn't need faster heals to be meta. Maybe once gun shield bleed through is added (soontm ) his pickrate may decrease as teams can't abuse the gun shield to level their evos and he becomes weaker in those 1v1 bubble fights with shotties where he currently dominates. But as for now I think he will still be high pickrate. He might even go up if Caustic teams w/o a Gibby decide to switch to Gibby.
I don't think Pathfinders removal of low profile will make him meta again. It was desperately needed but I feel his kit has already been too far surpassed by BH, Crypto, and Horizon. Want ring knowledge? BH and Crypto can do that while also giving valuable scan/drone information. Want high ground? Horizon can do that every 20 seconds safely, quickly, and quietly whereas ziplines are begging other teams to beam your whole team. Paths passive is a joke in comp because at best you can only scan 2 beacons a game. You really don't need zipline often enough to make use of the reduced cooldown from scanning beacons. And lets not pretend like removing low profile makes him harder to hit or anything. He still has a big hitbox so he will still be easy to down, just not as easily as before.
Horizon ult cooldown nerf wont really make a difference imo
Rev/Rampart buffs are irrelevant.
TL;DR: Caustic pickrate down, Wattson pickrate will rise but I think people will realize her passive buff isn't as great as it sounds for comp and other legends are more still useful, Gibby stays high tier, Pathfinder stays low tier (maybe some teams give him another chance though?), nothing else really makes a difference
ID: gq54daxI doubt Wattson is gonna be played much due to Gibby just being super strong and not really having much of a nerf. He's already at over 80%, and that's only gonna rise with Caustic shifting out of the meta. Some teams will surely play Wattson, but I feel like most teams won't wanna lose the recon for beacon scan, especially with how unpredictable ring is right now.
Gibby will be 100% or close to it, mark my words.
ID: gq5egusI would bet Wattson passive gets buffed to 1.0/sec like Octanes health regen after initial stats show no real uptick in pick rate.
ID: gq561uhI think you’re exactly right about everything except the part about Pathfinder, I think you’ll start to see more people utilize Path, especially players who want to main him again, Path also gives you slightly more mobility diversity then horizons tactical , we could still see Octane holding the place of Pathfinder if people are still uncomfortable with the large hit box though, It may be my bias but I want to see Path utilized more.
ID: gq54i1pGood read! I'm new to watching comp, what makes you think Rampart changes make her stay irrelevant? She offeres perfect cover, can't she take watsons spot?
ID: gq6np53I really think that they should give Path a two-ring scan, call it Recon+ or something.
ID: gq61kiyPathfinder buff is just for people who liked styling on people in pubs IMO. Doesn’t make him competitive but at least he’s playable now.
I agree lots of Caustics will become Gibbys if the nerf turns out to drastically reduce his effectiveness. The upcoming shield nerf is needed, but having the ability to take a little damage while getting “free” peeks is still strong even with it having bleed through.
Wattson needs more if she’s going to replace Caustic, if she’s supposed be the best defensive legend people actually have to be hesitant to engage in an area her team controls and I don’t think that’s the case right now.
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more gibby less caustic
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around 16 team playing wraith/blood/gibby and 4 team replacing one of three with crypto/caustic or maybe horizon
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I feel like the Mastiff nerf (which makes Gibbys slightly easier to fight) combined with the Caustic nerf might mean we see more Wattsons.
I can 100% see teams that play the zone and play defense (like Cooler) going to Wattson.
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- Some teams are planning on dropping Caustic (TL, for one)
- the EVA-8 has a chance at being meta. I think people will still try to have a shotgun at close range - it's impossible to bubble fight if you don't have one.
- heat shields should enable longer and further rotations. We'll see fewer "ok, we HAVE to take this terrible fight because there's no way around" scenarios.
- I don't think Wattson's new passive will do much. It takes nearly a whole minute to equal one shield cell.
- Pathfinder's pickrate will improve from "basically zero" in comp, but I don't think he'll be meta again.
- none of the other changes will matter
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I think the shift in meta will be crypto. I know he's had a higher pick rate in EU, but NA will also jump on the wagon. With the nerf to caustic, I predict an aggressive meta to evolve. Caustic was the last line of defensive legend to hold a building imo.
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Ppl keep saying that Gibby is gonna be picked much more which I do agree with, however, I would not be surprised if the meta shifted more to dive comps. Due to the fact that mastiff will be worse than the Eva Gibby is slightly worse as Gibby mastiff was really strong. Eva also pairs well with dive bc of the faster shooting and damage output. Just my opinion tho.
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Personal Opinion, this is based on a spectator view:
S+: BH, Gibraltar, Wraith
S Tier: Horizon, Crypto
A Tier: Octane, Caustic, Wattson, Revenant
B Tier: Bangalore, Pathfinder, Loba, Fuse
C: Mirage, Rampart, Lifeline
ID: gq5gyazAgree with your list but I think path would be in A tier with the low profile removal. Yea he’s not as good as blood, crypto, or horizon. But he offers something from all of their kits on one character
ID: gq691nkOctane was only picked once between both NA and EU (1 pick in EU) whereas bang was picked 6 times idk why you have octane over bang for comp scene
ID: gq8gw74I could see an argument for Bang being moved to A tier. Her ult is great to prevent third parties and so to are her smokes. Pair the smoke with blood and you have visuals in smoke fights. Also her passive of the increased speed could be strong in 1v1’s.
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Rev/Octane meta incoming even harder thats for sure since you do not have to worry about pushing building teams since there will be less caustics
ID: gq6c49cFor comp? I doubt it
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Hopefully, Wattson back in the meta with the caustic nerf.
ID: gq55bgtno ,more wattson=>more crypto=>NO wattson=>less crypto
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So Winter Circuit Playoffs is probs going to be another Wraith/Gibby/BH bonanza like Autumn was with Caustic being reigned in.
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The Caustic nerf will push caustic out of the meta, which was happening anyway especially in every region that wasn't NA. But it will happen faster and twitter can stop crying (even though the nerfs don't address the issues with his kit that makes him bad to play against). Wattson will never be played in comp now crypto can beacon. If people try and play her every beacon team will switch from hound to crypto and she'll get clapped. Even discounting crypto can delete her from the game she's still a worse less flexible version of caustic in every way outside of the pylon.
Gibby will be the most played champ unless the horizon nerfs sends all the fraggers running back to wraith. Path won't see play unless and until he gets a passive. Every team will have gibby so every fight will have two domes so every team will still be running mastiffs/evasSo from a comp standpoint, it's basically fucking nothing.
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The biggest change will almost certainly be the survival slot and every team having heat shields/mobile beacons. I expect 2 heat shields/1 mobile per team or maybe even 3 heat shields depending how they play out.
Other than that, less Caustic (but this nerf isn't going to totally kill him) and way more EVA.
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Path gives you mobility and beacon, Bloodhound gives beacon and info but no mobility. Horizon gives you great mobility but no beacon.
Path could be picked quite often.
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something that might tip the scales with gibby is whether you can still full res someone in the time the bubble is active.
ID: gq6bcstGibby still has fast revive. It's just heals that have been nerfed.
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With the new zone dome and the changes to Pathfinder, I think we might see Horizon out of meta and a return to Path/Wraith/Gibby.
Horizon is great mobility, q is good for vertical rotations and can float above caustic BS, end zone BS and the general insanity of end game.
But now that Path isn't low profile, you can still get scan for most of the same abilities; zone insanity isn't as bad if the domes become meta and people fight it out in the last zone; and caustic nerf may make him fall out of favor enough you don't need to counter-play.
I don't know that Horizon's ult ever really made much difference.
ID: gq63o81I don't think so path is objectively worse than crypto, bloodhound and horizon they are much more effective low profile was holding him back, yes but it's not enough to make him meta again
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Caustic won't be obsolete. But he will definitely be dropped drastically. Teams not running him will likely shift to Gibby, Bloodhound, wattson.
I'd love to see crypto more in NA but really just don't see it happening.
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I think most teams will run blood gibby wraith others comps can be wraith banga gibby or crypto gibby wraith or wraith gibby path or some horizon comp maybe 1 or 2 wattsons team as well !
i dont see people running caustic other than 1 or 2 teams who wanna bunker up till endzone
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I was actually expecting some sort of nerf to hound. I was hoping his scan would be reigned in a bit, so instead of just pressing Q and seeing everything, you sort of had to be more precise with it. Also, I expect more buffs to Wattson. Her pickrate is basically zero in pubs and ranked, and this slight buff probably won't increase her pickrate in competitive play. For a purely defensive character with literally zero offensive upside, it's way too easy to just ignore her fences or break them.