I know usec an the lore and all, however AR platforms,and AP ammo should be a lot harder to find what do you think?
Edit: I’d like to thank everyone for their thoughts. I’d like to clarify a few things.
I want it to be FIR only. No flea no trader, and it should be very rare, as well as AR platforms. I love the early/mid wipe fights. Piece meal gear, slapping mods on your gun mid raid, and ... topping off your mag with those three AP rounds you just found. That’s my Tarkov. IMHO you shouldn’t be able to run chad kits over an over an over. The cost to run high end military gear raid after raid should be brutal upon death. This is suppose to be a war zone/survival situation, that shit just wouldn’t be laying everywhere due to geographic location and supply shortages after any length of time. This would cause people to use their gear intelligently, oh I need to run into factory an plant these markers, you know you are going to run into lots of action there. Time to gear up. OTOH it should make just as much sense to throw a duffel over your shoulder with a shotty if you need to run to get some meds then run out. I’ve played every patch. Limping out of a raid with half a mag left hauling out a few extra goodies after a close call is as good as this game gets... again just my opinion.
The codification of tarkov is killing it for me. I know changes are coming, I still have faith.
I agree that 995, m61 etc shouldn’t be able to be crafted to diversify the “meta” moreID: h1s3oze
855a1 is just as viable with the fire rate of the weapons that use itID: h1s6xaj
Then people who play for hours and hours will have tons of them, and those who don't will not even be able to buy them. You widen the gap between casuals and chads.ID: h1s6lf2
Pretty wide right now for everyone who isn’t running around with clas 5-6 armor cause they started late lolID: h1s7sen
I don’t even wear slicks anymore, everyone is running ammo that makes them useless.ID: h1sfgkm
I bought the game 15 days ago and am at 30 mill stash and maxed hideout upgrades for lvl 21 that I'm at currently. Sure there's a wide gap but it's not that hard to build your way up, it requires some strategy though definitely. The first couple days are the hardest if you're starting for the first time like I was but once you save up money kits aren't that expensive. If the gap is wide it's kinda your own fault for whatever strategy and runs you're doing. You can make a couple mill an hour on reserves easy.ID: h1sh3xt
Makes sense that people who play more will be better off than someone who barely plays
Contributes to the "high value loot rushing" problem. Also massively buffs the profit-from-failure gameplay loop powered by Secure Containers. It also contributes to the over-distribution power of the Flea Market.
A way to cause AP ammo (or any other item) to be genuinely rare without the problems listed above is to make the only source for those items FIR Barters which randomize the required items every [X Time Period]. This cuts out the ability for players to use the profit-from-failure mechanic to farm items without having to survive. It also prevents stale farming meta and force players to explore different areas of the map as the barter requirements change. Also cuts the Flea Market out of the equation.ID: h1s26f6
Profit from failure how? Shoving ammo up your ass will never be profitable. You have to survive to be able to sell it on the flea. But I do like the idea of adding FIR barter for lots of high end items.ID: h1s9puy
To obtain high tier AP ammo is to profit. "Profit" isn't limited to generating cash. Any time a player brings out from a raid more value than that player brought into that raid when that player fails to extract (by using Secure Containers) then that player has profited from failure. If you bring nothing but a pistol and your Secure Container into a raid, collect loot that is more valuable than that pistol, and die (or fail to extract by any other means), you will return to your Stash having profited from that raid. That raid would be a net gain to you even though you failed to extract and were punished by losing the pistol.
FiR does not imply hard to find/rare. Being rare merely increases the price on the flea market. And price is already how ammo is balanced, so FiR only is not a requirement to change how often it's used.ID: h1s1v0d
Just remove ammo from the flea period would suit me. Get what you can from traders. Craft what you can/want. Use other ammo if you are out. That would be a massive changeup to the meta.ID: h1s2rki
This. I'd really support shifting to flea being only weapon attachments, quest/hideout items, crafting items, keys, and backpacks/rigs. Keep ammo, armor, weapons, helmets, and other meta items off of the flea. Traders will run out and people will have to run other gear or find them in raid.
It will still not solve the problem with no-life players easily able to farm them but it would extend the mid-game and for most players I feel would enjoy it better.ID: h1s7otb
Just remove ammo from the flea period would suit me. Get what you can from traders.
Help me understand your logic. I buy all of my ammo from traders. I get 55A1 from Skier and Peacekeeper. I get AP SX from Mechanic. I get M61/M62 from Peacekeeper. All of it, without exception, is significantly cheaper than it is on the flea market.
So what would removing it from flea do besides screw over lower level players who don't have max rep/completed missions?
Being level 59, I don't need to buy ammo on the flea. But others who are trying to compete with me do.ID: h1sajs6
That would kill the playstyle I've used this wipe. The only way I'm firing top tier ammo is buying it on the market. I didn't do the hideout or really any questing.ID: h1scqac
That's how it's going to be at release anyway. Might as well rip that band aid off.ID: h1s03b1
fir only means not on the flea market eitherID: h1s0eo5
all FiR items can currently be sold on the flea market. OP did not suggest changing what FiR means.
Alright lets squash this idea once and for all
•AP ammo rare -> Class 5-6 "too strong"
•Class 5-6 FIR/nerfed -> Mid tier ammo pop spike
•Mid tier ammo (BT, 856a1 etc) becomes meta against class 4-3 -> "BT ammo should be FIR only this is bullshit"
•BT ammo & alike becomes FIR only -> "Class 4-5 Armor is too strong. It should be FIR only"
Its a never ending cycle, just slapping items as FIR only and etc will not help as proven before with other items, and shown with my theory as above.
The true solution is simply more balancing stats wise. If they dont want meta, dont set the game up for it. Having 20+ ammo types and everyone uses 1-2 all wipes is just a waste of resources and faux difficulty by confusing new players. 3 ammo types for each caliber based off levels, with minor differences stats wise (slight ap on one, etc) , and call it a day.ID: h1sgg91
Making BT FIR only just makes people hatcher run reserver even harder.ID: h1sghfb
everyone uses 1-2 all wipes is just a waste of resources and faux difficulty by confusing new players
Nikita just got rock hard but he isn't sure why.
I’m gonna have to say no. The best few ammos should be. I’d be okay with something like 55a1 and better being way harder to get. Not just the top ones. It’s sad to see more than half of all ammos never usedID: h1s73bp
Bottom tier ammo types will still NEVER be used.
Of course "over half of all ammos are never used" because this game has SO many different flavors of poo for every caliber type.ID: h1s78of
They’re only bad because good gear is too easy to get. You wouldn’t mind using m855 if players had level 3 armor. But everyone either has level 6 or just doesn’t use armor.ID: h1sa3dn
make helmets have realistic protection levels instead of level 4 5 and 6 and suddenly most ammo because usable
only basic stuff should be sold by trades tbh, hollow point and ps ammo, rest find in raid only and/or crafted
I do think that it needs to be more rare, but I don't know if crafting only or FiR only would be better. As it is now with crafting, you could probably 2-3 raids with the amount that you get per 8ish hours of crafting. FiR in small amounts might be the better option. However either way, I'm still going to be able to buy all the m61 I want. It doesn't matter if its 1k or 3k. Now I feel like less people would buy it if it was up at 3k+ but still I'm just not sure if thats the answer. I think the best answer to make AP ammo rare would be to make way less available at traders and make it so that we can't sell it on the flea. I would love to have fights with low tier rounds throughout the wipe.
All this would do would raise the price and make it so the primary people with M61 and M995 would be the people that hatchet ran on reserve for 3 hours.
-1. A stopgap measure.
You're entirely right, but I think that this should be added when we have a better loot system, like this ammo shouldn't spawn in a jacket pocket in factory, it should spawn in a locked room guarded by scavs on Reserve or something. Ideally that would be awesome, it might be asking for too much though.
It's sort of like only having level 6 armors and whatnot only spawn on bosses and stuff too, really it shouldn't be spawning inside of caches, I can't even count the amount of hexgrids and slicks I got out of caches, it doesn't really make sense.
Unless if crafted instead of "go fucking farm gluhar if you want even a scrap of 995" I don't want this change.
It'll just increase the gap between casuals and hardcore players, and it'll be annoying for me because I'll have to spend extra money on armor when I do rat runs in reserve tunnels with a Kedr.
Yeah, they already did that with 993! KEKW
Oh... oh wait...
Personally, I think it should be extended to most items. Level 4+ armor should have to be either barter, found in raid, crafted, or quest locked. High level attachments, better medical equipment, and more should be gated too. For example, perhaps level 4 armor is able to unlock batters by completing quests. Maybe level 5 armor can be crafted by taking a level 4 plus more. Just spitballing here, but making it difficult but rewarding to get those high tier and elite items. Also, they need to redo the loot pools to reflect the scarcity of these items.
Just run into reserve armed with an m4 and 100 round mags loaded with HP or warmage. People will die and you will laugh
Being able to craft valuable things in general is bad. It just makes everything valueless faster. Plus once you let people craft quest items they arent quests that you need game knowledge for, they are just buying stuff off of flea market simulators.
They have the opportunity to try it with the upcoming wipe, but they'll probably mull over the idea for another 3 years. Things move so slow in this universe. There's an obvious problem when two-shot-thorax-through-anything rounds are readily available for $20 a round, but there's been absolutely no movement to fix it -- only to make it worse -- in the last few years.
if that includes also crafting. Yes, why not?