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First - Dell has an AMD EPYC offering under the R7400(7001) and R7500(7002/7003).
When asked for quoting we asked for AMD and Intel options and they act like AMD does not exist. Because we are not vendor locked we quoted from HP and Lenovo. Both of these OEMs gave us Intel and AMD Quotes.
What in the hell is going on with Dell and AMD? If its not them trashing pro-consumer lines, like the G5SE 5505, they are not selling AMD server products to their customers.
AMD is this on you from a PR level. You absolutely need to get in front of Dell and find out what in the hell is going on.
I do smell a little bit of anti-trust going on here.
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You should post this under the dell Twitter account. It would be an amusing thread.
ID: hd1209gID: hd14sidLink to the tweets??
ID: hd1h0y9The current CEO was the CEO of VMWare, which owns Dell currently. If he left stooges there, Intel won't have trouble bribing them.
ID: hd1hmmfDell owns VMware and will be spinning them out. Dell got VMware when they acquired EMC.
ID: hd2v8jsintel bribed or used anti-competitive measures with dell last time AMD was competitive. They got sued for it. Seems they may be doing it again. when the fines are less than the potenial damage to your company, you do the shit, hope you don't get caught and pay the fines if you do, cause a few fines is better than your company losing tons of customers.
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Dell has a history of being in the pocket of intel, and have been sued numerous times. They pay the fines and keep doing the same thing. They have yet to be punished financially worse than they gain financially by behaving this way.
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There are 3 guarantees in life: death, taxes, and Intel bribery
ID: hd2jmfvThere's 5, you missed off by one errors.
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My job is also looking at server upgrades, and we talked with Dell. I specifically asked for AMD quotes, while noting I was fine getting Intel ones too. Their people came back only with Intel quotes, and I again noted I wanted AMD ones to compare. They finally sent some.
To my surprise, the AMD quote ended up roughly $1,500 more than the Intel option (about $7.5K vs. about $9K). Part of this seems to be that they offered a higher-level EPYC processor than the Xeon Silver we were getting, but I also couldn't find an AMD alternative in the price range of the Xeon Silver in the Dell portfolio. I don't know if it's an issue where AMD doesn't have a product in that lower tier, or if the Intel chips are getting crazy incentives to keep customers out of EPYC servers.
Whatever the case, I was hoping to see my previous experience--AMD winning handily on per-dollar performance--but got the opposite. It's hard to explain to your non-IT boss why you should pick something that costs 20% more when the need doesn't exist.
ID: hd29zt4Intel is absolutely offering insane discounts on their server CPUs to stay competitive. Intel will lose money to keep from bleeding market share.
ID: hd2pkleFinancialHorsepowerID: hd36nepWith the beginning rise of AMDs second Threadripper, we had OEM sellers at the table who flat out refuse to sell AMD based workstations. The guy sat there completely adversarial to the large customer, tried to sell rebate 20% on Intel workstations as some sort of "once in a lifetime" deal you wouldn't never get again. They got the workstations from another vendor. How in the world must Intel pay that you can skip on a ~2000 x 5000$ per machine order? Until this day their alternative provider selects Intel and AMD boxes by the intended workload (some CAD software and their 3rd party plugins still only work well with high single thread speeds). They never believed they could land that large customer by being just neutral sellers.
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Two possibilities: chip storage is impacting EPYC production and ship times and Intel Xeon chips are ready to ship from Dell and they don't have enough EPYC chips at the moment.
Possibility 2: The old "No one got fired for buying IBM." synonym applies to Intel products in 2021.
ID: hd0r1u3The thing is OP quoted from both Lenovo and HP which they gave him both quotes from AMD and Intel, that means possibility number 1 is out of the question.
ID: hd203xxA few months ago we ordered a batch of Epyc servers from Dell. We made ourselves a spec with the public website (r7515 and r6515, zen3, nvme, etc etc), then sent our sales rep a link: give me a quote for this link.
The normal back-and-forth ensued, we had to correct mistakes in quotes and alter some components because those would cause delays.
In the end there were lots of delays. One batch of servers just showed up, almost 4.5 months later.
The components supposedly causing delays were mostly things that would be in common with Intel: SSDs, NICs, and BOSS cards.
Though the selection of Zen 2/3 CPUs available was limited -- about 2/3 of the SKUs were not available. Luckily we got a good enough deal on a Zen 3 CPU close to what we wanted (TDP a tad high, but we can limit in BIOS).
ID: hd0xuelDell could have different expected deliveries. If they know they will not have difficulty meeting sales targets for AMD, then their internal management is going to strongly incentivize pushing customers to Intel which will be harder to sell.
They could quote AMD but perhaps those sales people had no incentive to do it. So they did what was in their own best interests and not that of the customer.
ID: hd25th5Possibility 3: Intel is still bribing Dell
Possibility 4: Dell just remembers the bribes they used to get from Intel
ID: hd2wdrhPossibility 4.5: Dell is courting Intel for the bribes they remember
ID: hd1fp6xLet's see that adage hold when your company gets owned through yet another vulnerability in Intel's Management Engine.
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Dell remembers the billions they received from intel... "illegally"
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Dell is incompetent when it comes to their Intel machines too. Try looking up Code 43 for the Dell XPS 15. Laptops just fry their GPUs for no apparent reason, and if it happens outside of warranty then SOL. I had the G5SE too, that puts the PS4 to shame.
When you say the pretend they don't exist, do they just actively refuse to provide AMD quotes, say they don't do AMD or literally ignore any request for AMD?
ID: hd0i3xoThey refuse to quote them, act like we never said "AMD" and move on with their day. They provide Intel only quotes and thats it. even though its in writing!
Yea I am one of the first G5SE owners, did all the engineering that brought the fixes and sources to all of its issues, my post history has my guide pinned if you wanna see how deep we tore into it. Dell should be sued over this.
ID: hd0iws0I did actually use your post when I had the laptop. My biggest worry was when I came to sell it, having to just pray the next person wouldn't have the same issues and try and return it. They never did, so I assume they know what they bought in to.
I had the SSD problems, where the only fix was full removal (adding a different drive as boot drive was not enough it seems), the weird static effect that randomly flashes up on the screen, and probably some other stuff too.
ID: hd0imxaIt is like pulling teeth trying for them to acknowledge AMD… I am still n the same boat with quotes with only the Intel quotes and no mention of AMD. Also took 4 months for an AMD Dell consumer line laptop, and still came in with last years model CPU (4700)
ID: hd0k1myI used to work at Geek Squad and I can't tell you how many XPS I saw come in with either fucked Intel iGPUs or Nvidia GPUs months after the warranty ended. Like a $2k machine.
ID: hd0sv6iThere’s a reason that every MacBook Pro with a Nvidia dGPU had an extended repair program due to the GPU dying. Hint - it wasn’t Apple’s fault…. And if you think it was, it’s mighty convenient how the same issue is so prevalent on so many other ultrabooks with them.
ID: hd0kluwNot surprised. It's big enough of an issue on the XPS 15 with the Nvidia GPUs dying that you can find it on Dell's own forums, where they just give BS reasons such as re-install the driver, even though they must full well know what the real reason is.
My research says that it affected as early as the 9550 (maybe earlier) and as late as the 9570 (possibly also 7590), which means 3 years (at least) of laptops with the exact same fault which they never fixed.
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What dell who were a big part of the reason Intel got sued for forbidding the use of amd cpus in prebuilts is still ficking over amd well I am shocked and surprised./s
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When I was working fortune 50 IT I watched Ryzen come up and destroy Intel in perf/watt and dell didn't even offer it in their desktops. I wouldn't be surprised if they still aren't offered or it's like two models and there's an upcharge. I know you can get home desktops from dell with Ryzen chips but I can't find anything about office boxes with them.
ID: hd0xff7Wow are there really still no Ryzen Optiplexes? This is incredible. They've been in Lenovo and HP for years, right?
ID: hd0xzk8There was like one or two models a few years ago but they were very hesitant to sell them.
/comments/ct4wyf/dell_no_longer_selling_optiplex_or_server_lines/?ampcid=1*xdpuqc*cid*YW1wLWNTbXRLNlMyT3ZDQUxTMWVWYzJCRUE." class="reddit-press-link" target="_blank" rel="noopener">https://www.reddit.com//comments/ct4wyf/dell_no_longer_selling_optiplex_or_server_lines/?ampcid=1*xdpuqc*cid*YW1wLWNTbXRLNlMyT3ZDQUxTMWVWYzJCRUE.Dunno about now.
Edit: holy shit it's worse than I thought, not only do they not sell Ryzen boxes but they've hitched their whole business line to Intel vs AMD messaging (guess which side they picked)
Not sure but let's be honest. Here it makes sense as only the repurposed laptop chips (APUs) make sense in such boxes due to lack of iGPU in regular Ryzens. Plus that many businesses are more and more 100% laptops so it's probably not worth it anymore to make 2 designs.
BTW have a look at gamernexus looking at a Dell (alienware) prebuilt with a Ryzen CPU. I have never seen anything more sketchy and crappy. They use an intel cooler with some adapter on the ryzne cpu.
Remember when Dell hired the former AMD CEO, Rory Read, back in 2015? It was met with optimism from AMD fans who liked Dell products too. That didn't last long.
Remember when Dell and AMD combined to release the very first all-AMD Ryzen laptop with an RX5600M, which was also the first, and in 2020 the only laptop with SmartShift? It was a complete disaster! Truly.
Full disclosure, I too was one of the first G5SE owners. My laptop is only useable thanks to the efforts of some very talented people on
, in particular who put in the overwhelming majority of the hard unpaid work. Feel free to peruse that subreddit for proof of everything he and I have claimed. And while you're at it, don't buy Dell anymore.Intel PR money at work.
This needs more publicity. This Dell and Intel shady business needs to blow up.
Intel and dell have anti competition history.
It will be dells downfall
Dell have been captured by Intel for as long as Dell have existed. Survey says Dell owners are also Intel shareholders. The loyalty goes beyond anything logical.
No trouble buying AMD from Dell here (large academic institution). We haven't bought an Intel server in two years. Our peer institutions are doing the same.
I dropped Dell servers too for that, I went with HP HCI servers instead. Not going to buy a subpar Server CPU.
In the past Intel has provided incentives that encourage anticompetitive practices. I wouldn't doubt that is happening again.
The fact that Intel’s bribes used to comprise almost 90% of Dell’s revenue at one point is true insanity. Dell was basically a sub brand of Intel at that point.
Yup and it falls under anti-trust. Just needs to be investigated.
The Epyc is completely owning the Xeon right now. I can’t think of any technical reason Dell wouldn’t want to sell them. I can think of a marketing reason: First rule of selling is to get the customer to want, and buy what it is you’re selling. I’ll bet Dell is getting the short end of allocation from AMD, and is trying to sell Intel because it’s what they can get their hands on. HP and Lenovo each have half again the total market-share that Dell has. If I was AMD, and I didn’t have enough product to go around, I know whose orders I’d fill first.
The CCDs that go into the Epyc are made on the same 7nm TSMC node that everyone and their mother is trying to buy capacity on, hence short supply. OTOH, Intel is, relatively speaking, swimming in 14nm and 10nm capacity.
Considering that HP quoted 7003 BTO/CTO servers with a 6 week lead time, you might be right about supply from AMD to the OEMs based on selection. However that does not really explain the lack of discussion on Dells part about AMD to the customer, specifically when pressed/asked.
This is all just mind numbingly frustrating.
I feel your pain. Like I said, first rule of selling. There’s no upside for Dell talking up a product they don’t have to sell you.
Yeah, its a case of "do you want power efficiency with AMD, or availability with Intel?" Kind of a trick question, but given Dell's history with Intel they could make up any excuse and they're beyond the point of believability.
My team has bought tons of r7525s. It's not a Dell thing, you have a bad account rep. Email their manager and complain that they're not doing what you ask.
I sometimes wonder if its a regional thing too. I do know that in some spaces Dell operates "cleaner" then others. Esp when Edu vs Private vs Public vs Defense.
Intel still paying out those bribes?
引用元:https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/pp1f17/dell_will_not_sell_us_amd_epyc_they_push_r650s/
Dell will not sell us AMD EPYC, they push R650's with XEONs instead
Oh I did 🙂