How does wraith avoid the same fate as Major Anderson

1 : Anonymous2021/03/03 14:26 ID: lwv3sx

So spoilers for effect and cause from TF|2

So one important part of Effect and Cause is the grizzly device (however it’s spelled, I forget). This lets the user travel between two time periods, Jack uses it to go back and forth from current time, to the past when the facility was in better shapes. I’m going to assume he goes through the void, but even if he doesn’t it’s still an interesting question for wraith.

So at the start of the mission BT finds Anderson dead, halfway through the floor. Then you go kill some stalkers and prowlers and you find his bottom half to get the grizzyl device. The common theory is that he was in the present and jumped through a hole in the floor. But when he switched time periods the floor was there and he kinda got stuck in it and died. We can assume this since an important mechanic in the mission is to time your jumps to the past so that you fall through holes and such that are only there in one world, and you can die instantly if you mess it up. (Especially that pipe drop)

So my question is how does wraith avoid this while using the void. Like she can see inanimate objects, but can she see people while in the void canonically? Or would she have to hope she doesn’t pop up inside someone and kill them or her (if you come out of phase in the same place as a pilot you kill them, if you come out of phase as a Ronin Titan inside another Titan or reaper you kill yourself.

So can wraith see people and/or has she accidentally murdered people or could she kill herself accidentally?

2 : Anonymous2021/03/03 14:29 ID: gpjblnf

Canonically, other wraiths in the void warn her of trouble, which include people, which can only mean that wraith can see people while traveling in the void.

ID: gpkwb33

There is maybe more than a few wraith who died because of that too

ID: gplt4oj

Only one wraith unlocked the ability to phase so, no

3 : Anonymous2021/03/03 14:43 ID: gpjddih

It seems like:

In Void she can see other people

Major Anderson's device got broken by the grunt, that is why it took it a whole to teleport him and why he died.

Major Anderson's device travelled in time, Wraith's device in space; they are different.

ID: gpjj8nq

Right, coz Wraith’s whole thing is interacting with parallel events isn’t it? Not time travel

ID: gpmfkja

I've seen a few comments here asserting or agreeing with what you said in point #3 (that traveling through space and time are different from one another) but I want to emphasize that Einstein taught us this isn't true. Space and time are inextricably correlated together; if something is traveling through space, it must be traveling through time (and vice versa).

The important part isn't space vs. time but what direction they're traveling through time.

Anderson went backwards (and forwards), Wraith only goes forwards. Because of entropy, things deteriorate over time, into the future. And because of causality, it's much easier to find yourself in an object if you pop back to a time when more objects existed in the space around you than going forward to when it found its way to intersect your path.

Sometimes Wraiths do end up in objects; the train on World's Edge is a good example. If maps had more moving parts or destructibility, then more Wraiths could find themselves inside objects.

I have a separate comment somewhere here about how Wraith could actually uses her tech to avoid phasing into objects.

4 : Anonymous2021/03/03 14:49 ID: gpje370

I think that what Anderson had was a kind of time machine like that in Prince of Persia(I forgot which movie). Wraith’s ability allows her to enter some kind of black hole which lets her to choose between which dimensions she wants to visit( the time where this takes place) the quantum theory has been proved which says that there are infinite parallel universes running so they found a way to alter between them. You are quite correct because according to our current knowledge, there is a theory that says that you could access these parallel dimensions through a black hole and at the same time black holes are also believed to let us time travel. My theory is that the voices from the void come because of another version of wraith that died in a parallel universe and tries to protect her from dying. If you’ve noticed while in the void you could see some shadows that are like wraiths who died in another universe.

ID: gpjxte3

The Wraiths in the Void are alive, as seen in the Voidwalker short. There are just infinite dimensions, so there could be an infinite number of Wraiths in the Void at any given time.

ID: gplbpg0

you talking about the dagger from Sands of TIME

5 : Anonymous2021/03/03 14:53 ID: gpjelb9

While Major anderson’s device allowed you to travel to different times, and therefore through objects (assuming the object is not there in one of the timelines) wraith’s device travels through space, not time, so while she can go through people, she cannot go through objects. I believe the ability to go through people is in place for a gameplay reason rather than a lore reason, so an enemy can’t cockblock the wraith by getting in her way during phase.

6 : Anonymous2021/03/03 15:29 ID: gpjjcqq

I don't think that the time travel device is using phase-shift tech like wraiths ability.

With the time travel device, the jump is instant, while Phase Shift allows the user to move from current to another dimension in a controlled manner (seen in the Voidwalker short). This probably allows her to dodge the "Anderson Paradoxon", as it's called by some.

ID: gpjjqvr

Oh and I think it is canon that she can see people while phasing as it's also shown in the Voidwalker short if I remember correctly.

7 : Anonymous2021/03/03 16:09 ID: gpjosmm

Canonically wraith can see people while void walking since she sees our wraith and an employee in the cinematic

8 : Anonymous2021/03/03 16:15 ID: gpjpmy1

Wraith doesn't travel between time, she travels between different realities.
Major Anderson must've slipped-up and travelled between where a hole was or wasn't, or went too fast as a result of slipping between times.

9 : Anonymous2021/03/03 21:42 ID: gpkz98v

Because it’s an entirely different thing, why does everyone think it’s the same thing? effect and cause is time travel phasing is entering another dimension briefly

ID: gplhgjg

Not entirely different. It's been stated several times that Wraith's tech is very similar to the Ark and Cooper's device. In fact Cooper's device was used to create Wraith's tech.

10 : Anonymous2021/03/03 17:56 ID: gpk3xow

I mean we do see this when she is in her phase form and tried to go through a door that closes when she comes back out of it she gets instant death

11 : Anonymous2021/03/03 18:33 ID: gpk92jh

Ok this is actually a pretty good question, I think it’s due to the multiple versions of herself in the void. They are probably guiding her.

12 : Anonymous2021/03/03 19:23 ID: gpkfywp

She can see other people in the void in game already. In addition to this, it’s different tech and she can see walls and such too and her alt selves warn her about stuff.

13 : Anonymous2021/03/03 20:56 ID: gpksvbt

I think even functionally what we see as the player explains why she has an easier time—she can see the space she’s moving to before she’s there. With the time warp device, it was automatic with no “preview” of the destination.

14 : Anonymous2021/03/03 21:20 ID: gpkwa1g

I found wraith, she’s uh in the ceiling..

15 : Anonymous2021/03/03 21:57 ID: gpl1bgc

*Cooper finds Anderson dead after fighting his way through part of the facility

Also, the device allows for time travel, while wraith phase shifts, not traveling through time. Wraith wouldn’t be able to die like Anderson did because he supposedly time traveled from a time where there was no matter overlapping with him, to a time where there was, and he wound up in the floor. Wraith interacts with and navigates using inanimate objects since they’re present in both the phase dimension and the standard one. Wraith can also see people in the dimension she’s navigating, but sometimes you see/hear shadows and glimpses from others. Wraith cannot die like Anderson did since objects won’t appear inside wraith, but wraith should be able to appea

inside other people or organic matter like how you could in titanfall since she is already able to walk through them when phased.

16 : Anonymous2021/03/03 23:17 ID: gplbhkq

no andersons fate was the result of the soldier who fought him in the past, whilst disarming him by smashing the gun out of his hand, he was also smashing the device against that same railing, it then went haywire and started rapidly jump him between timelines and the soldier tackled him over the railing causing him to fall, the soldier broke his neck on the floor below (if you look over the edge you see his body) and anderson fell through the facility till he was swallowed in the wall

so it could be possible for wraith if she tried phasing through walls, but andersons fate was the result of the device becoming damaged

17 : Anonymous2021/03/04 06:27 ID: gpml6pc

If we hypothetically weren't bound by what the game provided you might think Wraith would find herself inside objects all the time; even the slightest variation in the position of something could cause her to phase back into it. How could she actually avoid this?

Preliminary Knowledge

Maj. Anderson's Time Gauntlet can't help us understand Wraith's tech because it violates principles of relativity and causality. We cannot gain any insight into how Wraith's tech works if we cannot properly explain how the Time Gauntlet works, and as far as we understand, the Time Gauntlet is impossible (but it's an amazing level so it's ok).

Anderson's device, the Time Gauntlet, was undoubtedly more powerful that Wraith's Phase tech because traveling backwards in time violates principles of special relativity in which the constancy of the speed of light dictates that nothing can travel backwards in time, not even light (you can visualize this idea through Minkowski spacetime diagrams, which show light can only travel 45deg away from any origin point). The idea that particles can travel backwards in time (Feynman–Stueckelberg interpretation) exists, but that is definitely not a full human being and gear so we'll say there's no precedent to suggest this is even possible.

So let's just focus on Wraith. Her Phase tech uses quantum-mechanics to justify how she interacts with the world; specifically, the Many Worlds Interpretation:

The Many Worlds Interpretation, an application of quantum mechanics that posits that there exists a multitude of parallel dimensions in which all the possible outcomes of a given "event" are realized among them. The more likely outcomes exist in more of these realities, so they probabilistically happen more often (assuming experiencing any one timeline is equally as likely as any other). This probability distribution can be represented as a wave and represents the uncertainty of a particle's potential location, or in more complex quantum systems, the likelihood of a particular event.

How Phase Tech helps Wraith avoid being stuck in things

When Wraith phases, she enters a space in which the information from parallel timelines overlap (information refers to the state of particles; this constitutes everything, including people and objects). These intersections always exist, but without the Phase tech normal observers cannot sense information occurring in parallel timelines, let alone be able to manipulate that information.

Just as a particle's future is uncertain before it is observed, Wraith path through spacetime is uncertain and this does not violate causality because her vector in spacetime hasn't left the bounds of her previous worldline. She's still confined to the same possibilities, but the exchange of information between parallel timelines expands and influences the probability space some.

That last bit is the key to understanding why Wraith can avoid things like environmental hazards: the exchange of information between realities can help her make some paths more favorable and some paths less favorable. It's essentially like constructively-interfering with the parallel timelines that yield favorable outcomes (amplifying their likelihood) and deconstructively-interfering with non-favorable outcomes (like ending up inside of a solid object).

Can Wraith's Phase tech actually exist?

So the previous explanation is fine for the confines of a sci-fi universe but in our universe quantum-mechanical laws and phenomena do not hold for all scales and don't necessarily apply at macroscopic levels. So the question is it still possible to explain Wraith's tech without physically leaving reality?

Theoretically, it's possible that her phase tech doesn't actually displace matter at all but disrupts the perception of reality, and can influence not just her reality but what reality those around her perceive. Here we're taking advantage of the fact that our perception of reality is discrete: at any instant things have defined points in space and defined values, but these are emergent properties of an uncertain universe. If quantum technology could sense and capture information from adjacent timelines,we could exchange this information to our brains and theoretically alter reality, or at least our perception of it. In order to physically protect herself, Wraith takes two parallel realities, one original and one new, and forces those around her to observe the other's reality. In this new reality the conditions are near-identical to the original, except that she does not currently exist where she was in the original. These new enemies are being brodcast the consciousness of those from the original reality. They saw Wraith a moment ago, but now all they see is a trail (her phase trail). This is an energy byproduct that she emits from the interaction that she's facilitating between the two realities. Since she isn't physically here in this new reality, they can't damage her as she isn't there to damage. Simultaneously, she is feeding the consciousness of the new reality back to the original enemies. Remember that Wraith is still physically here in this original reality, but now the perceptions of these original enemies are from a reality in which Wraith isn't there to begin with. This means these original enemies would never think to attack her as she was never there to attack let alone think about attacking. It’s because of this that she knows that she wasn’t hurt in this original reality as she travels the Void; it effectively makes her impossibly improbable to have been hurt. Upon the collapse of her Phase, everyone in her vicinity will resume perceiving their original realities without notice. Technically at this point, the "original" reality has diverged into two realities, one in which Wraith has now influenced them and herself with the phase, and one where she hasn't. In the previous, original reality, Wraith never phased, and the original enemies are unaware that anything has changed from a moment ago. In most cases Wraith is still in danger, hurt, or possibly dead in this original reality.

TLDR: Yes. It's a bit convoluted.

18 : Anonymous2021/03/07 03:04 ID: gq264ww

If I had to guess it’s the same reason you can’t delete yourself by standing too close to a wall in Titanfall, Major Anderson had a prototype and the Pilots, especially Wraith, have a much safer version that prevents them from getting stuck in things


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